it's been sighted in backyards stealing food and swimming pools and somebody set up a facebook page. the cheeky monkey has loads of fans. >> we have a problem here. >> say again, please. >> houston, we have a problem. >> houston, we very much do have a problem. to quote the vice president, it's a big [ bleep ] deal. >> the parents and children who have a preexisting condition will finally be able to purchase the coverage they need. that happens this year. [ applause ] >> maybe not so fast. welcome, i'm neil cavuto. the white house scrambling to fix a glitch in the healthcare law. as it stands, kids won't get full protection until 2014. are we going to see more like this after the rush to get

healthcare reform through. bob has been sorting this outs. the selling point was preexisting conditions for kids kids covered day one. >> that's right. this is a drafting problem with the legislation and the administration's scrambling saying they have to issue new regulations to fix this issue. they want to get the kids covered right away but the way the law is written, it can't happen. the adults, as far as preexisting conditions, it is bulk of the benefits won't kick in until 2014 but the kids could have started this year. but it remains to be seen if it happens. >> neil: kids and adults preexisting doesn't kick in for another few years. >> that's right. then there's also a prescription drug discount for brand name drugs. if you're a senior in the medicare doughnut hole of coverage, you get some benefits

this year but as far as a 50% discount on brand names, that won't happen until 2011. some benefits really don't kick in for a couple years but the bulk of them don't kick in until after all next presidential election to republicans are running on a mantra of repealing this. >> it was sold to the very few congressmen who might not have read this thing as bible in this thing and gospel in this thing that at least for kids and preexists illnesses, covered day one. for adults, a lot of their illnesses in the short years to follow. drugs and the discounts. day one. were they sold a bill of goods? >> well, when you put together this massive of a bill that's 2,000 pages there are some mistakes made. this is an embarrassing one for the administration. they're basking in the victory of passing the bill and they think they'll fix it right away.

will there be other implementation problems? probably. we saw that with the medicare prescription drug program with the republicans. republicans are talking about this, this kids issue, this afternoon. >> i remember when i was in washington monitoring this, that was, as you pointed out a big selling point. i wonder whether it's going to give any pause with the reconciliation efforts going on now onto the senate or whether they're going to, at the very least, had to add new language that would have to send this thing back to the house to be voted on and complicate things. >> that's a great point. that's going to come up in the next couple days. why don't we fix this right now. democrats are trying to make sure that doesn't happen. they don't want to have the house vote on this again. they're telling members whatever the amendments are that republicans are offering, don't vote for it or change it bill so we can pass it and be done but republicans can claim this was a

given. let's fix it right now. >> neil: and here we go. thank you very much. >> the public option is still an option. congresswoman lynn woolcy wants a government run option for the national health exchange. democratic congresswoman shelly pengray of maine plans to co sponsor that legislation. congresswoman, do you expect this to go anywhere? this is something that obviously the senate took out to make it more palatable at the time for what it thought would be a super majority vote, 60 votes. now all you need is 50. what do you think? you never know. there were a lot of people disappointed that the public option wasn't in the final bill we passed. and so lynn woolcy promised to

introduce a bill once we get through the passenger. this is still a important conversation and i'll pleased she's introducing it. >> if it survives as a stand-alone measure that means an add on to the bill we have, right? >> right, but this way it's not part of the negotiations between the house and senate. what fits in to reconciliation and what doesn't. it can live on die on its merits. >> neil: that gives folks the heebie jeebies, things being changed after the cake comes out of the oven. >> we're focusing on the bill itself and this bill does a tremendous amount of good but people felt it was important to have this conversation. a lot of people who don't like the changes don't like the bill. >> neil: you're right but it comes on the day we're learning the key selling point that, call

kids with preexisting illness would be coverednd and that's not the case and the drug discounts will not star start this year but people will say, i don't know whether i was sold a bill of goods. >> no, i don't think anybody was sold a bill of goods. >> neil: you know what? those parents or kids with were consist -- preexisting conditions are thinking that. >> we'll fix that. >> neil: when will you fix it? >> it may be fixed between the house and senate now and i guarantee the white house will make sure it's changed. >> neil: didn't someone read the writing to say this thing we thought we have, we don't have. the president's going around the country championing this as a done deal. someone should whisper to him we read the bill and it's into the in it. >> it's in highly technical

language. it's a technical fix and we'll get it in. >> neil: i'm no lawyer and i'm going to defer to the judge, who is a great lawyer, but i have watched a lot of perry mason episodes on tv and i'll tell you, with all due respect, i read that portion of the bill where it was clarified and even an idiot like me can understand it doesn't take effect immediately. its clear, over a period of time, 2014. i'm thinking, well, i mean i understood that and i'm not the sharpest tool in the shed. >> what are you going to do? sometimes you get too many lawyers in the mix. >> neil: i'm not beating up on you and you mean the best of intentions but a lot of your colleagues apparently didn't read this and they're standing by something that could be different than the way it was sold. >> again, i think you're

bringing up an issue that some people are concerned about today but it will be fixed shortly. >> neil: so you think italians limits -- it's limited to a couple of items? it's like they unearth problems you have in school and more problems come out. that was my entire school years. what new are we going to uncover? >> you know, look, people have talked about the passage of social security and medicare. there were giant fixes to that and many pieces that didn't come into play for several years. as somebody said, this is an enormous piece of legislation as we talked about. we will continue to comb through every piece, make sure it's implemented and i'm confident we will deliver what we promised. >> neil: the only exception, in somethings we never told anyone you're going to get the money the first year, this to the dollar and then pull it. >> well, most of these things we've been very clear with people what takes until 2014 --

>> neil: this you said was now. you guys said -- when i was in washington, i got tired, doing eight, ten hours straight but that one got through my thick school. immediately, immediately. >> i agree, you're absolutely right. we promised the public that the children cannot be denied for a preexisting condition and i'm sure we'll implement this legislation the way we said. >> thank you very much. >> the president got his pen out again today but no hooting and hollering. just a president behind closed doors signing the bill promised to the pro-life democrats. fox news senior analyst and a real lawyer, andrew napolitano says they were duped. >> the statute, which the people who voted for it didn't read -- you just had that interview with the congresswoman who didn't

read it. if you read it says when the government provides you with insurance, it pays for the policy are from a private insurance carrier and that policy can cover abortion. the president can't change that with an executive order. >> we can go back and forth on what is in the bill. they say it's not that black and white in the bill and regardless. the president tried to reaffirm this. >> if it's not in the bill, you don't have to have the executive order. it was a figure leaf, so to speak, to congressman stupak and his colleagues, the pro-life democrats, to say to the folks back home, don't worry, even though it says it will pay for abortion, the president will sign paper saying it won't. >> neil: you're not saying they were duped. >> they were dude. >> neil: you're not saab they are duped? i'm saying they were duped if

they think the -- it can't trump it or put a spin on it. it's legally meaningless. politically it may be a value to them. >> neil: but what is it with executive orders? can a president -- i've heard one president's executive order can be overturned by his successor but it can be overturned by the president who rights it. >> absolutely. bill clinton signed an executive order which he decided he didn't want and overturned it. it's an order from the president to people who work for him in the executive branch to do something or not. the government hires outside contractors. bill clinton signed an order saying the outside contractors have to be members of labor unions. george bush says get the best contractors labor union or not. the law is silent on whether or not they have to be labor unions. the president has that discretion.

if the law says it will cover abortion, the president can't undo that with be an executive order. he can only fill in the gaps for the people who work with him. >> so he's wasting his time. >> not politically but legally. >> lies the government told you. >> this is a lie that the government is telling you. if they tell you that the president's executive order will stop the feds from paying for abortions. it won't because it can't. >> neil: you're the best, that's why this is an automatic bestseller and will live on the "new york times" bestseller. >> the healthcare fight ain't over and we're headed back to washington. i forgot my laundry at the hotel. they said neil, what are you doing this weekend? we're going back on friday, live. 4:00 p.m. eastern as the debate on reconciliation rages on. our live coverage continues that night at 6:00 p.m.

saturday, a two-hour edition of the cost of freedom. i'll update you, if i find my laundry. now, forget whether that piece of paper means anything for bart stupak. it's meant the world for the guy to wants to unseed him. hell have no furry like -- don't look now but you teed off the gov. hailey basher teed up, riled up. next up. they are. ♪ so many, many reasons they are. ♪ it's so m'm! m'm! good! ♪

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don't look now, the titanic is leaving port again. not that the healthcare thing is the titanic but didn't they say when healthcare's backers are saying the same stuff, it's unsinkable. 15 states are trying to save the

tsaers are including governor haley barbour. what are you up to? >> i notified my democratic attorney general that we intend to litigate the healthcare reform bills going into effect, joined with a number of other states. and i've asked him to let me know tomorrow if he'll accept that representation or do we need to hire outside private counsel. >> he sounds cool to the idea. maybe i'm misreading -- >> we've eight statewide elect the officials in mississippi, state officials. he's the only democrat. >> neil: secretary ofso that coa parts but he might say you're capitalizing for politic gains. >> i'm trying to save miss mismoney on direct taxes. we have have to raise taxes on

mississippians to pay the 150 to $200 million a year of additional medicaid state spending required by this bill. they've delayed it for a few years. i won't be governor anymore. but the fact of the matter is all that is postponing the hanging. we're going to have a huge tax increase in order to pay for this. secondly, there are more than $500 billion of tax increases at the federal level. so in addition to about $48 billion of tax increases required from the states, there's about $570 billion of tax increases and much of it falls on small businesses. my state's economy, the backbone of our economy, is small businesses and small businesses get clobbered in this. >> neil: couldn't -- i'm talking to you with your former party

hat label attached. that is how this might look. that republicans couldn't win in congress, so they're taking it out in the courts and you guys look like whining babies. what do you -- >> the left's done that as long as i've been around. what they couldn't win at the ballot box they won in congress. they've had a straight party line to put the into effect something the american people are very opposed to, have made plain they're opposed and the left shoved it down the country's throat despite opposition. the fact is much of this does not go into effect for many years. and this is the right time to challenge the constitutionality before it goes into effect. you know, does the federal government have a constitutional power to force people to buy

health insurance and in fact go beyond that and tell them what health insurance they have to buy. this law says, you can not buy any health insurance after about three years, you can not buy any health insurance that hasn't been approved by the united states department of health and human services. they're going to have a health commissioner over there. >> neil: bottom line, your ag has to respond yes or no whether he's going to pursue this tomorrow. >> if he opts not to, we'll hire private counsel. >> man oh man. thank you very much. >> good to talk to you. >> are republicans courting disaster? frank luntz rules and the deal signed and delivered.

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>> neil: stall it, repeal it, file a lawsuit. republicans doing everything they can to challenge the healthcare bill but could at tht backfire in november. frank luntz, author of what americans really want. frank, appearances as you remind me count for a great deal and many don't get caught up in the weeds but the appearance is that republicans are trying to get settled in the courts what they couldn't in congress. that doesn't appear good. what do you make of that? >> set the context, one-third of americans support this legislation and are celebrating today. one-third of americans oppose it

and will do anything to get rid of it. one-third are someplace in the middle, they support healthcare reform but not necessarily this reform. the key for republicans -- by the way support has gone up a few points since sunday night. american people have, as they tend to, rally around the success of either a president or a legislation. >> neil: how long does that last? that's like a president after a state of the union address or -- what's the shelf life on that? >> it tends to last until reality sets in. i've got two points of reality of the every american above a certain income level will pay more. every american will pay more for this legislation, even though most of the benefits don't kick in for a number of years. the second thing, which i'm surprised not many speak about, is the fact the i.r.s. has

significant responsibility over this legislation. neil, there are going to be 16,000 new i.r.s. agents hired as a result of this to make sure that you're properly paying taxes and properly signed up for the right healthcare plan. i don't think the american people will like that. that said, it's hard to keep anger up for eight months in a row. >> neil: one of the things that's forestalled the anger issue, you hear a lot about, an republicans are raising, is this notion that there are a number of bennys that kick in immediately, the kids with preexisting conditions are covered, drug discounts begin almost immediately for seniors. in both cases, that's not the case. not all kids letter covered right away nor illnesses or drugs covered right away. so something that was a gimme and a carrot held out to accept the stick ain't what it appears.

>> that's a very smart approach. and i apologize for using hands in front of my face but it's the best way to illustrate it. in politics and policy, you set a certain level of expectations. the way voters respond on election day is whether you go above or below expectation. it doesn't really in some cases matter what the specifics are. what matters is what you expect to get versus what you receive. what the obama administration has done in the last two weeks is set such a high bar for expectations, it's almost impossible for people to achieve it. and so i argue, neil, and i was debating on sunday night whether or not to say this to you, the republicans are very close at least in the house to being arguably achieving the majority. based on polling, based on turnout and expectedtation. i was there in 1994, so i saw what happened. the question for the g.o.p. now is are you going to be the

opposition party and just complain about the legislation or are you going to promote an alternative, which will bring independents to your side. we can't call that yet. it's not clear what the senate or house will do but what republicans say will determine what happens eight months from now. >> neil: eight months is a long time, buddy. >> exactly. >> neil: all right. frank luntz, great seeing you again. >> thank you. >> neil: what is it with the obama administration and chamber of commerce. it's ugly. chamber chief is fed up and itching to tell us why because tom donahue is here and only here.

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the guy who works in the building across the street but the administration is attacking the chamber saying it's trying to kill the overhaul of the financial systems rules. what does the chamber have to say about that? tom donahue joins me now. >> great to see you, neil. >> they don't like you. they don't like you. they do not like you. >> well, i know you're trying to make a big story out of that. let's see what happened here today. we had two-thirds of the financial regulators from this -- this administration here participating with our group that are talking about the reorganization, reregulation of the financial markets. >> neil: right. >> i thought it was a great meeting. they sent over the -- >> neil: they didn't share the glee because the deputy treasury secretary said -- let me clarify with folks. the deputy treasury secretary

said the financial overhaul was sorely needed and the lobby group's obstruction was unacceptable. >> yes, and here now i may be give you a story. i think the department secretary treasury is one of the five or six most important jobs around this town and i would rather have heard from the secretary -- he's very experienced, very bright, some substantive recommendations as we're negotiating with senator dodd and others to come up with adjustments we need in the bill to make it work. you know, of all the subjects we're going to follow over the next weeks, we have got to get this right because every other subject follows and whether we're going to get out of this recession -- >> neil: i know, i know you're a diplomatic nice guy but even i can see where there's smoke, there's probably fire. this goes back to the time you were nice enough to chat with knee on your building

overlooking the white house which is as close as i got and you got. i wonder if there's something going on here. i thought the bad blood had gone away but that was then and apparently it continues now. what's going on? >> i think i would tell you that the speech was written by the political department and certainly not by treasury. n q&a and discussions with the press, he began to look at the subjects. i told him clearly we want to bill, we want a bill this year. >> neil: no, no, they're seeing you -- tom, i love you but they're seeing you as an obstructionist on healthcare and on this. they're almost putting it in those exact words. so what's happening? can you guys smoke a peace pipe? >> i have one of the five best jobs in america and i represent the job creators in this country. that's what i'm focusing on and if i let myself beties tracted

every time a political operative decided not to like what we have to say, we wouldn't get much done. >> neil: no, no, he's not a political operative. he's a big dude with the president and -- >> he clearly read the speech. >> neil: the president has on various occasions singled out c.e.o.s among your chamber members and whether it's healthcare, c.e.o.s or others, it's a familiar theme. i'm just asking, just as a human being, if on any level you feel you're banging your head against the wall. >> i've been around this town a long time and people that get themselves angry and feel they're banging they're head against the wall don't prosper. get up early, work on it every day, carry your message and over time you do better. making it personal -- >> neil: okay, tom, you're not -- fewer classier -- that's

why you have a big job and i just read a prompter. >> no, no. >> neil: when is the last time you physically have been in the white house? it's been a while. >> neil: what's a while? what's a while? >> no, months. >> neil: months. that -- listen, my friend. >> wait, wait. >> neil: months. >> we've been invited to come. >> neil: you're not there. >> the bottom line is we have a seat at every table in this town. >> neil: apparently not the white house. >> maybe because either i wasn't invited or when i was invited, i was out of the country and bruce joseen went. >> shepard: your number two would go. when is the last time he's been in the white house? >> many times in recent weeks. >> neil: so i'm making a big deal outs of nothing. you're very tight.

>> come now, don't lead me down the primrose path. we're tight ownership on things we need to be tight on. we're looking at climate issues, very engaged in education and working on infrastructure. but this is a political operation. >> neil: tom, i'm saying you're blocking. i think you're blocking. >> you may think i'm blocking. i think we're working it in a way that's going to let us keep going longer, further and better. >> neil: it's always a pleasure. thank you very much. i love having you on. >> well, it's good to see you. i'll be up soon. >> neil: thank you. a quick programming note. we're headed back to washington. the healthcare battle continues and we're live there friday at 4:00 p.m. eastern. coverage at 6:00 p.m. on the "fox business." if you don't get that. >> demand it? >> indeed. saturday a two-hour special of the cost of freedom kicking off at 10:00 a.m. eastern where the

quest will be for the luggage i lost when last in d.c. more coming up. the president signing the executive order that won over congressman bart stupak's healthcare vote, now it's kicking my next guest's campaign against stupak into high gear. > [ male announcer ] years ago,

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>> neil: boy, the big signing. healthcare bill becoming law was a big event. television covering it and this is all we have of the executive order signing on the abortion thing about a concession to congressman bart stupak for his yes vote and other right to life congressmen who were similarly assuaged as a result. that's all we got. no television cameras were allowed. the stupak abortion deal turning into a good deal for the

republican running against the congressman. congressional candidate dan benacheck is getting 16,000 new facebook friends and a bump in donations. we invite bart stupak on and he declined. doctor, what has this meant for you? >> hi, neil. thanks for having me on. it's been a rapid change in my life, i'll tell you. we were watching the -- the bart stupak on tv and michigan state on the other channel and as soon as the speech was over, the phone started ringing and it's been a zoo ever since. >> neil: all right. how much of that is on the whole abortion issue, doctor, and how much is on just a big package that has a big price tag for which americans are concerned about the big burden? >> well, i think a lot of people

are very upset about flip-flopping on abortion. >> he says he did not flip-flop. >> he's been fighting that issue on the other side for a long time. he's the one standing up there saying he's not going to accept this and all of a sudden he did. >> neil: but the president signs the executive order, which depending on the constitutional lawyer you talk to, andrew napolitano says it's not worth the paper it's printed on and others say it's very much like the rule of law and only a future president can rescind it or the present president. what do you make of that, they got what he want and the president delivered. you don't buy it? >> i don't buy it. do you buy it? it doesn't have a force of law. nobody voted on t why can't he rescind it tomorrow? >> neil: you think this does nothing to take out the language if the bill that clearly allows federal moneys to go toward

founding women's abortions? >> well, as i understand the bill, there's -- there's money to establish some clinics that some say the way the funding is structured, courts could allow them to provide abortions. >> so directly or indirectly there's a way around it and you don't -- >> it may address it. i don't see how the executive order can't be overturned tomorrow or the next day or anytime this president or the next president decides to take it away. it doesn't have the source of the rule of law. >> neil: quickly, doctor, we're getting reports and audio released of death threats that congressman stupak was getting as soon as he indicated he was going to vote for this package. some of the pretty scary. what do you think of those? i think that's rather unfortunate and i hope nobody

tries to do something like that. that's not right. you can't condone that. i can't condone it. >> neil: okay. doctor, thank you very much. >> i appreciate it. >> neil: meanwhile the attorney general who is going it alone challenging healthcare reform, says it ain't personal. it's just this. nature knows just how much water vegetables need. so, to turn those vegetables into campbell's condensed soup, we don't boil it down, our chefs just add less water from the start. ♪ so many, many reasons ♪ it's so m'm! m'm! good! ♪

>> neil: all right. virginia governor bob mcdonald aiming to block the government healthcare plan, filing a lawsuit to stop it on constitutional ground. the suit is separate from a joint lawsuit filed by 13 other states. virginia attorney general, ken cuccinelli joins me. very good to have you, thanks for coming.

>> good to be with you. >> you got this ball rolling and you have a distinct ball rolling. you don't want to join the others. why not? what's the difference? >> well here in virginia, as you noted, the governor ceremonially signed our healthcare freedom act on a bipartisan basis during it is general assembly and it protects virginians from being forced to participate in a individual mandate for healthcare. as i said, it passed a democratic senate and republican house so it's popular in virginia. we're defending a virginia statute. it's only appropriate to bring that case in federal court in virginia as opposed to joining the 13 other so other attorneys general who have filed in florida. so we are unique in this respect. we wouldn't take a virginia statute to florida. our basic claim is that because of the individual mandate in the federal bill, it conflicts with virginia's bill and under the

supremacy clause of article 6 federal law trumps but not when it's unconstitutional and it's power position that mandate goes beyond the power, the commerce clause of the constitution in article one provideses to congress. >> neil: right from the get go. there many residents in your fine state, though, attorney general, who like this healthcare reform effort and argue, look, if it's going to cover me and my family, whether this year or next year or in a few years, whatever the details may be, attorney general, don't get in the way. >> well, my first obligation as the attorney general of virginia is to defend the institution of the united states and virginia. that's what we're doing here. i'm defending a law of virginia and the constitution of the united states. both of those things and pushing back on federal power. i have an obligation to protect these -- the constitution and

the statute and we're going to fulfill that obligation. as you said in your opening, it's business for our office. >> neil: but attorney general i know that -- i'm sorry, but i notice with the exception of the louisiana attorney general who is a democrat, this is almost an entirely republican affair. cynically one could say this is just politics. >> well, we don't have any cynics in virginia? okay may a few hundred thousands but seven of our 11 congressional representatives, two democrats, voted against the healthcare bill. our virginia healthcare freedom act protecting us from individual mandates passed with support in the democrat senate. it couldn't have passed but a the democrats control the senate in virginia and there were democrats, including the minority leader who sported it. >> neil: why not get -- i understand, why not go to the

ballot box. if people are ticked off, and a number of people are, then state your vengeance in november in the ballot box and don't go through the courts. >> well when something is unconstitutional, you deal with it in the courts. policy and electoral issues been dealt with in november and in years to come for some offices, but there's an appropriate place for each aspect of the discussion, if you will. the policy discussion takes place in the electoral arena and in congress. the constitutional discussion, which should take place in congress, though we think it was trample thed upon, is decided in the courts. >> neil: quickly, if the court agrees -- >> we're using it to protect virginia. >> neil: if the court agrees, by nature, wouldn't it strike down not only this feature, but essentially the entire bill is shot, right? it's gone. >> it is quite likely that if we

prevail and the individual mandate is determined to be unconstitutional as we believe it is, the entire bill would fall. that's correct. >> neil: attorney general, thank you very much. >> thank you for having me. >> the healthcare thing wasn't a rush job? why are so many democrats today rush to go explain a whole lot of problems today? boss: y'know, geico opened its doors back in 1936 and now we're insuring over 18 million drivers. gecko: quite impressive, yeah. boss: come a long way, that's for sure. and so have you since you started working here way back when. gecko: ah, i still have nightmares. anncr: geico. 15 minutes could save you 15% or more on car insurance.

>> neil: little bit of a problem about those kids with prior medical conditions all being covered under the health care law now. not all kids. apparently not all conditions. turns out they rushed that one out before they checked the fineprint out which is surprising since democratic leaders insisted they weren't rushing anything out that was just republicans trying to do this reform in. democrats insisting this wasn't a rush job it was thoroughly vetted, debated for

the better part of a year. that's why they didn't want to scrap it and start from over. it was meticulously crafted and fine-tuned from the . epic crafted over many months but to hear nancy pelosi tell it over years. republicans just refused to read. apparently republicans were not alone. the democratic authors shocked to learn, you heard from one earlier, not only this thing about not all kids being covered, but not all new regulations included or all drug discounts being ready. not all drugs are, not all regulations are, things happen when you say you are not and fail to vet things when you swear you are that is when you discover the rush job you insisted you were not selling is just another snow job no one in this country is -- no one, not a soul.

friday we are back in washington, snow job rush job it is my job to distinguish and be back there. we are back there because the health care battle is far from over we are starting at 4 p.m. eastern time friday they are going to take up the second part the reconciliation measure. which was thought to be smooth sailing now with these new details emerging, maybe it is not a slam-dunk. the fun continues 6 p.m. ear time on the fox business network. i'm not always smiling, i'll be tense, trust me. back at it saturday. there i am still smiling. a special two hour -- it has been one of these thing -- one of these weeks where i have very little sleep so i might get punchy if you stick and it could be a pay-per-view event. we are monitoring this because it is that big, that important and room service is